Jason Hartman discusses the tax deadline in light of the Coronavirus. He continues a conversation with George Gammon as they talk about The Doom Vortex/feedback loop, oil prices, bonds, and what the world needs to prepare for. They discuss economic trends and changes as a result of the pandmeic.

Jason Hartman 0:00
I have to say that meet the Masters is what really sold me on your group and just the turnkey world in general. Welcome to the creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You’re about to learn a new slant on investing some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world’s most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine self made multi millionaire who’s actually been there and done it. He’s a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who’s owned properties in 11 states had hundreds of tenants and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason’s footsteps on the road to your financial independence day. You really can do it. And now here’s your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors. Thank you for joining us today for part two of the last episode. Welcome to Episode 1409 1409. Thanks for joining me today. Obviously, it is an absolutely scary world with what is going on due to the corona virus epidemic possible pandemic, the US Treasury. And I don’t know that this has ever happened in the hundred and five year history of your favorite agency, the Internal Revenue Service, the IRS, the biggest taxing agency on planet Earth. I know we’ve got listeners in 189 countries and you may not have to deal with the IRS Lucky lucky. But any American living anywhere on the planet has to and I believe it may be the first time ever. They are likely to push back the April 15 tax filing deadline. Wow. Are there enough indicators This is serious. Italy has basically shut down their country. Israel is requiring too weak quarantines for anybody entering the country to make sure they’re not sick. SXSW giant annual festival in Austin, Texas has been canceled. And there is a website to raise money for all of the people who lost their gig. Now this is the part where you’re going to see this trickle through the economy. A lot of video producers, audio visual people, etc, etc. Now look, we had to postpone our meet the Masters event. We had to postpone our venture Alliance mastermind trip to Austin Texas venture Alliance was in San Diego, California. Do I get a bailout? Is someone going to bail me out? Is someone going to set up a donation website to let collect donations for us? Uh huh. Probably not. not holding my breath for that one. Okay. That’s how it always feels, you know, yet, you know, from the government from private fundraising, whatever it is. I mean, heck, I’ve paid into the system forever. I never collected any unemployment. I don’t even have a library card. What’s wrong with this? I tell ya.

Jason Hartman 3:17
That’s the way it is. That’s the way it is. But here’s something I wanted to tell you on the health side that I think is very important. There is so much misinformation about Kovac 19. out there. It is. absolutely ridiculous. First off, this is not a drill, do not take it lightly. This could turn into something extremely serious within the US. It’s already very, very serious in several countries around the world. But here’s something interesting that I just recently learned. I have been researching this topic, ad nauseum since it really took hold in the media. And this may surprise you, younger people with stronger immune system And this generally applies to you know, people under 40. Okay, you know, 40 is the new 25. Right? Those people may represent a high risk factor for you, for other young people for, you know, whoever it could be people in their own peer group. Here’s why. And this is what’s interesting about it. As you know, one of the very dangerous things about the corona virus is that it’s asymptomatic for up to 14 days, okay? Now, think about it. Anybody with a compromised immune system is going to show symptoms, they’re more Well, they’re not necessarily going to, but they’re more likely to show symptoms, and they’re more likely to show symptoms more quickly. So you aren’t going to have a scarlet letter, right? That you can see on them. Right, you’re going to know they’re sick and you’re going to know you need to distance yourself, but the people with the healthiest immune systems are The most likely to be asymptomatic and be the carrier. Okay, so be careful. This is now an extra layer of caution that we need to think about. So very important. You know, there’s many things to know, we’ve talked about many of them there. You know, you can go to the CDC website, the Center for Disease Control, and many other websites to learn more, but I thought that one was particularly interesting and unusual and something people may not be thinking of. And that’s why I wanted to share it with you.

Jason Hartman 5:30
Okay, we have super low interest rates. And one of the side effects of this is that you can see the rates out there on websites like bankrate.com for mortgages, however, when you actually go to shop for your mortgage, which is the free money that you can get now, as a real estate investor, when you go to shop for that mortgage, you may not be able to find rates that low and that’s kind of an Interesting thing, these lenders are so busy now with the massive flood of refinance applications in purchase applications, because everybody wants to take up this opportunity for this cheap or really free, pay you to borrow money, which you should do. I mean, if you know this is a fantastic opportunity for real estate investors, but many of the lenders are basically increasing their rates, even though they could give you a lower rate. They’re stating the rates as higher to turn business away to deflect business. Can you believe that? Like who would want to do that, but that’s what’s happening. Okay? Now, this won’t happen forever. But processing mortgages is a real bear. You know, it’s a complicated thing. It’s very labor intensive, obviously, and the mortgage lenders many of them are just too darn busy. So they can’t keep up with the work. But listen, get in line, get your application in, by your properties lock in on these incredibly cheap mortgages. That is the big bargain right now. And think of it this way. Look, say for example, the coronavirus or just generally the asset bubble in many areas. I don’t believe that’s in the linear markets we like. But I think certainly, we have won in the stock market. Even still, we have won in the high end real estate markets for sure those high end cyclical markets around the world. They’ve already been suffering for a long time, outside of the Cova 19 scare. But think about it this way. Okay. If you get that mortgage today, and you keep it for 30 years, you won’t make the last payment till 2050 2050. The cyphy future that we see in movies like what will 2050 be like? Will we be traveling at warp eight, eight times. The speed of light, you know, will we be? Will we have, you know, colonized Mars significantly by them? Well, we probably won’t have broken the light barrier. That’s not what I’m predicting. Okay, that one? That one’s a bit difficult for sure. But you know, we will probably be I mean, there’s a very good chance we’ll be colonizing Mars, all the stuff that’s going to change by then there will be a huge space tourism industry by then there will be massive government debt, not just in the US, but in almost every government around the world. And what does that debt lead to inflation? If we have more bailouts from the corona virus scare, which we’re very likely to have them? I mean, it’s, it’s very likely we’re going to see an airline bailout, a cruise line bailout, and many other bailouts and lots of money printing, what does that mean? It means inflationary pressure, right? It means inflationary pressure, and so safer. Example, the economy goes into a recession, and say that that recession is pretty bad. And it last three years. Okay. So we don’t start coming out of the recession until 2023. Let’s just say that happens say that this is a very harsh and significant impact. Well, if you get your cheap mortgage this year, or hopefully many cheap mortgages this year, you’re gonna have 27 beautiful years ahead of you, Okay, with that super cheap money, even if we have a rocky road, like that’s the worst case scenario. And next week when we discuss the return policy for real estate, I think you’re going to be very interested in listening to that episode. It was recorded already with Evan Moffitt, who’s been on the show many times, and we’re going to talk about how you can return your real estate, you know, say you don’t like the deal, say the economy changes. Say you want to get out. We’re going to talk about that. So that’ll be coming up for you next week. And I think you will be very interested. But today, we’ve got part two, with my friend George gammon as we continue to examine the supply, demand shock, and how the tools that are typically used to stimulate the economy have limited effect. In this type of environment. They have some effect for sure. But the effect is somewhat limited because of the supply and demand issue. And let me tell you something else you can be very grateful for,

Jason Hartman 10:35
especially if you live in the US, love them or hate them. But President Trump has started the trend almost four years ago of bringing more jobs, especially manufacturing jobs back to the US. And that is great because it mitigates the supply demand shock problem with prior administrations Mostly if you want to blame the fact that you’re you haven’t had a raise or your job got offshored you can mostly blame Bill Clinton for that. Okay? Because when China got most favored nation trading status, that’s what ross perot warned us about with NAFTA. And you can blame Bill Clinton for that one to that giant sucking sound. That’s what happened. The jobs got sucked out of the United States. Okay. And that trend has been reversed by Trump, love him or hate him. That’s good news, because it does help mitigate the supply demand shock that George and I are talking about. Okay, if you have questions, if you want a portfolio makeover, if you need assistance from one of our investment counselors to help mitigate the potential for a very serious shock to the economy, that’s what we’re here for. Reach out to us. One 800 Hartman, that’s one 800 Hartman or Jason hartman.com And specifically, if you have a question or comment on the show, Jason hartman.com slash ask, you can go there. Alright, let’s get to part two with George gammon. Let’s, let’s move to the next concept here.

George Gammon 12:17
Yeah. So to give you kind of have a better image of what the corporate bond market looks like, I’m going to go to a graph, which is right here. And the scary part is you can see how much corporate debt we had in 2008. And that, let’s call it 3 trillion. Well, now we’ve got 7.5 trillion, almost 8 trillion. And but this is not adjusted for inflation, right. So I’ll give it a little bit of a hedge. Yeah, this is not adjusted for inflation, but we haven’t

Jason Hartman 12:54
it’s it’s still high but it’s not quite as high as it sounds. Okay. So yeah, but yeah,

George Gammon 13:00
Okay, and you’ve got to look at the triple B market. So this is the gray shaded area. And then the black, pink and red is the junk market. So you can see how small the junk market is compared to not only investment grade, but triple B more specifically. And the reason I keep harping on triple B, because that’s the the next step down for them is junk. Mm hmm. So moving on to the next whiteboard. This is another example of how it looks and the systemic risks in the system. So instead of a circle, this time I’ve got the square we’ve got the triple b 4 trillion, the junk at 1 trillion visa, we’re talking about the bonds here, okay? The corporate bonds above the 4 trillion, we’ve got 2.5 or above the triple B we’ve Got 2.5 those pension funds come in, they put in the money just like we talked about. And now I’m putting some numbers to it. So if the pension funds are getting a 4% return by buying this triple B debt, they’ve got to get that 7%. So there’s a big Delta there. So what do they do? Is they lever up? Mm hmm. So if they buy a bond for $1,000, let’s say that company gets downgraded, then that bond goes from $1,000 to $500, the face value of that bond, and if they’re at if they got 50% leverage, well, their equity is completely wiped out. That meaning the pension fund. Mm hmm. So into your earlier point, this is a pension fund that’s probably already underfunded by 50%. So this is catastrophic for retirees, for retirees for pension funds. You got it. Going just over to the right, I show the same squares but this is if that 4 trillion got downgraded into junk. So now your junk

Jason Hartman 15:11
so so the fourth look just help follow. Okay, so the $4 trillion of now triple B bonds get downgraded to junk bonds, then instead of having 1 trillion in the junk bond market, we’ve now got $5 trillion in the junk bond, right? Okay,

George Gammon 15:28
that’s right. But the majority of the liquidity can’t chase that. Because remember, the pension funds are excluded.

Jason Hartman 15:33

George Gammon 15:35
And that’s your main buyer. So if they’re excluded, you’re basically you’ve got 4 trillion of supply coming into a market that only has 1 trillion of liquidity. That’s why I say that it wouldn’t surprise me at all. If the interest rates in that junk market just doubled almost immediately. So then you say okay, Georgia. Sounds like Extreme, how would that 4 trillion go in all at? Not that it would at the same time, but how would the majority of that be labeled as junk? Well, you’ve got to look at what’s going on with the coronavirus. You’ve got to look at what’s going on with oil. We didn’t discuss that. But a good slice of that 4 trillion oil corporations. So if oil corporations have to deal with $25 oil, especially in the United States, they’re not going to be able to pay their debts. Yeah. So that’s how a lot of that goes down to junk. Also, because

Jason Hartman 16:36
we shouldn’t we should elaborate on the oil thing, because that’s a huge deal. That’s Yeah, but but go ahead. Go ahead.

George Gammon 16:43
So yeah, so that’s why a lot of those oil companies could not only go out of business, but at a best case, get downgraded. And then we go back to the Ford, the Heinz, all these non oil companies, but that are floating right on the cusp. Well, if the stock market goes down because of the coronavirus, that means the asset side of their balance sheet also goes down but the debt stays the same. That’s when Moody’s comes in or whatever ratings agency XYZ and says, okay, at&t, there’s no way that you can service your debt or you can’t service your debt as easily as you could prior to this recession. Because your cash flow isn’t there, your assets have gone down, your debts still the same, or it might even be at a higher interest rate. But Georgia, but George, Moody’s can just do what they did, prior to the Great Recession, they can just lie about the ratings. I know and if I don’t, if anyone noticed, in fact, maybe I should go back. Let me go back to this slide really quick. I know you’ll get a kick out of it. It’s kind of cheesy humor, but this is kind of the way I do my videos. You can well for the people who can see the video image you can see I’ve got this stick figure, which I use in a lot of my videos. little person. Yeah, he’s

Jason Hartman 18:01
got your, your family member fred or whatever. Yeah, yeah. Well,

George Gammon 18:04
this guy, you can see his cross-eyed. He’s got kind of a twisted smile. He’s actually holding a bottle of whiskey and his hat is M. And in the video I look at the camera, I said, What do you think that stands for? Let’s pretend it stands for Moody’s. No, yeah. Moody’s the rating agency have it. They’re drunk on their whiskey all the time. That’s right. You got it. You got it. Though, to your point, it does rely on Moody’s who is drunk half the time. So but assuming that that downgrade happens with your oil, your 18 T or four that’s how I’m getting that 4 trillion going from the triple B market into the junk debt market. So you’ve got the interest rates explode. Mm hmm. And how does that affect the corporations? Well, we talked about how it affects the corporations that are moving into the junk status but let’s not forget the junk corporate that are already there. So first and foremost, a company like Tesla, okay, well, yes, they have had a bump in their share price. But now it’s going back down. But sooner or later a company like Tesla or Uber, who incinerates cash is going to have to go back and they’re going to have to go and sell more bonds are going to have to sell equity, in order to generate the cash, they need to sustain themselves, especially if we go into a recession. If they’re able to borrow right now, at four or 5%. And their borrowing costs go up to 10%. They’re done. They’re done unless they have some sort of miracle which could happen. But the probability is that they go out of business as well, which puts more pressure on the stock market.

Jason Hartman 19:50
He the funny I got to just mention on Tesla, you know, Tesla is built on a house of financial engineering beyond comprehension. I don’t know how They did it. I don’t know how they have that recent run in their stock. I just don’t get it. Don’t get it. And yesterday I discovered a Twitter profile. I think it might be Event Horizon or something as the handle. And it he said, preparing for the criminal trial of Ilan musk. Yeah. I mean, it’s there’s so much financial engineering in that company. I just have no idea what’s going on. But it. Yeah. And what’s interesting about it is you mentioned and I think this was before we started recording, we talked for about 20 minutes before we started, I’m not sure this got on the show, is that with the oil price collapse, and maybe even a further collapse in oil prices? You know, of course, that means there’s not going to be any shale oil industry, because it’s just too expensive. And there’s going to be a lot less production. So there you may come into a future supply demand shock, but not in the foreseeable future. But you talk about the green energy companies and how they just won’t get any funding because yeah, Their business model only works if oil is expensive. And even then it’s questionable.

George Gammon 21:07
Yeah, I’d take it a step further and say their business model only works when we have very loose credit markets. And we’ve got really cheap money. And we’ve got the

Jason Hartman 21:17
government acting as a venture capitalist or giving handouts, which they should not do like Solyndra and Tesla, you know, cylinder has gone Tesla’s still in business, you know, if we get someone like AOC, and her crazy green New Deal. I mean, you’ve got the government picking winners and losers, the government’s in the venture capital business, right?

George Gammon 21:36

Jason Hartman 21:39
It’s crazy. It makes no sense to me, but yeah, who

George Gammon 21:41
knows what they’ll do. if they’ll do something like that? Again? I’m not sure. But

Jason Hartman 21:46
I’m not saying I agree with any of it. I think it’s ridiculous. Oh,

George Gammon 21:49
yeah, I know. But if they stay out of the market, then it’s those companies. The green energy companies are in a very similar position to Tesla, if they don’t make a lot of money, if any money at all, sooner or later, they’re gonna have to go back to the capital markets. And if there’s no money for them, then they’re out of business. So you get this situation where a lot of the oil supply is going offline, or potentially will go offline because of shale. You get tight money in the corporate bond market, and you’ve got the credit markets collapsing. So the green energy companies can’t be as competitive. So they’re not as much of a threat to oil, right. And it goes back to the old saying where the cure for low prices are low prices, especially in the commodity space. So I’m not here to say whether green energy is good or bad or oil is good or bad. I am here to say that from my vantage point, the five year or 10 year outlook for oil if this plays out, could be very good.

Jason Hartman 23:00
Now that’s very interesting, but it’s probably gonna get a little cheaper. First, we might actually start giving some stock tips on the show. Even though we love real estate, we love income property. So that’s kind of an app.

George Gammon 23:12
Everything is a function of price, right? Absolutely no question cash flow, whether it’s the mortgage, whether it’s a real estate property or a dividend paying stock, and so many people accuse me of being bearish on the stock market, but it’s not really true. I’m just I was bearish on the price of the stock market. If I can get the stock market at a 80% discount,

Jason Hartman 23:36
well then I might not be so bearish, even me who you know, commandment number three thou shalt maintain control, which I don’t like having middlemen in my investments. I don’t like you know, being subject to the the graft and corruption of a fund manager in investment bank, a CEO, a board of directors, you know, because they’re skimming all the profits off the top, but when the disk Big enough, you really mitigate that problem quite a bit. So I agree I’m Listen, I’m a, I’m an opportunistic investor. So

George Gammon 24:08
yeah, yeah. And I want to go back to the right hand portion or on my right. And because I think there’s a couple things that most people don’t think about. So even if they’ve heard about the corporate bond market, and they understand the tie between that and the stock market, I think they’re not taking it another step, which which I’d suggest, and that’s to understand that these pension funds are going to be in deep, deep trouble. So what are they going to do most likely, and these pension voter talks about state pension funds? Well, they’re going to try to raise taxes. So they go on with property taxes, they go in with a VAT sales, who knows they’re going to try to take every last penny that you have, and they’re probably going to have to do that in a time where the United States is going in into recession. So that’s why I’ve got it written up on the board here. What that means is what presents another really big problem in the sense that during a recession, tax receipts plummet, right? tax receipts Really? I know it sounds crazy to say this, but they don’t have a lot to do with tax rates, believe it or not, right? Oh, yeah.

Jason Hartman 25:20
Well, my listeners already agree with that concept. Mostly because you know, that the point if you want to collect more taxes, and you’re the government, you need to expand the economy, you need to grow the pie, you need to increase the size of the pool. And the way you do that is by not intervening too much and not being too greedy. The pool, the pie gets bigger. Okay. And then yeah, you get more revenue. You know, that’s what Reagan really proved. And, and remember, Reagan looking back on history, he did not have the benefit of the fax machine or the internet, increasing the velocity of money and expenses. The size of global markets, he didn’t have the benefit of globalization, really, I mean, most of this stuff that really lent a big powerhouse to the economy was post Reagan or at least at the very end of his term. I don’t agree with that. I’d love to hear what you think of it, by the way, but most people don’t recognize the internet and the fax machine is no big deal. I think it’s huge.

George Gammon 26:21
Yeah, what most people get wrong about Reagan, is they always say that he had an a revenue problem. He didn’t have a revenue problem, you know, spending problem. And another thing I’d point out about Reagan, is that keep in mind the interest rates on government debt during the time of Reagan, I don’t know the exact numbers, but I would be willing to assume they were well north of 10%. Oh, yeah, Volcker had to do. And a lot of the debt is short term that the government has to roll over every two years or so. You compare that to a an interest rate on the national Out of 23 trillion of maybe 2%. So, although, yes, Reagan did have a spending problem, he he also had a problem of the amount of interest he was paying on the national debt was much, much greater than it is today. But going back

Jason Hartman 27:20
to one more thing about Reagan, Reagan had a business plan for his spending, okay. His business plan was to bankrupt the Soviet Union. And that was achieved. I mean, listen, history can argue with us. Yeah, you know, people have different opinions. But that was a business plan. There was a finality to that, that actually, you know, you could argue in the long run saved money because it ended the arms race to a large extent. There’s no business plan for the welfare state. Okay. government handouts is not a business plan. It doesn’t make people independent. You know, that’s been proven over and over. So I don’t know you. We can talk about this till the cows come home.

George Gammon 27:58
I totally agree that the way We’re spending money is counterproductive. It’s

Jason Hartman 28:03
not investment grade spending. Okay, exactly.

George Gammon 28:06
You’re not going to get a money multiplier. But going back to the key thing there, Reagan dropped rates to call it 25%. But if you look at tax receipts as a percentage of GDP, they were just as high as they were back in the 1950s. When all the movements of the world say that we lived in this Nirvana, because the tax receipts were so high, that is a complete fallacy.

Jason Hartman 28:33
doesn’t know what he’s talking about.

George Gammon 28:35
percentage of the receipts as a percentage of GDP were very similar in 1950, to where they were in 19. In the 1980s. It they really don’t change too much if you look at a chart. So my point is that what really affects tax revenues though as a percentage of GDP, at the stock market and recessions so if we Go into another recession. And in my opinion, if we do, it’ll be worse than 2008. Because the debt is so much higher, that means the taxpayer is not going to be able to fund these pensions. So this feedback loop that we’ve been talking about, it gets even worse and to make it and to take it to the next step, you got to look at all these baby boomers who have been retiring, and they’re taking money out of the stock market. And if we go into this negative interest rate environment, they’re going to have to save even more money, their

Jason Hartman 29:38
retirement, living will be nowhere near what they expected. So there’s gonna be not

George Gammon 29:42
not even close, but they’ll be spending a lot less. And if you look at demographics, I think you just had a Harry dent on the other day, but the US economy has gotten a lot of the tailwind or the headwind from the baby boomers. Generation sure whether it’s the spending, whether it’s their investment habits, they

Jason Hartman 30:04
change the world as they were moving through the economy, the baby boomers, right, more than any other demographic or just change the whole world.

George Gammon 30:13
Yeah, right. So now you’ve got that massive glut of people that’s going to be that would normally be reducing their spending habits because they’re going into retirement now. They’re going to be reducing their spending habits 10 X, because of the pension funds, negative interest rates, they can’t get a return on their money. Then if you look at consumer spending being 70% of the US GDP, that’s why I call this segment the doom vortex.

George Gammon 30:45
That’s what I call

Jason Hartman 30:45
this this feedback loop. It’s a feedback loop. That’s a very good way to look at it. No question about it. Okay, so you invest in all kinds of stuff you like real estate, you like income property, as do I, I think it’s the best thing going I can really only see Two strategies for this. I think the cheap income properties that are necessity housing are great. All you have to do is people just got to pay their rent, regardless of what values do we invest for yield. So you know, we don’t care about values too much. I mean, pay, listen, work. We’re happy as a clam if they appreciate. But we’re not expecting that. We’re investing for yield. So if people will just pay their rent, and we can maintain our expense ratio, we’re in good shape.

George Gammon 31:28
Yeah. So I think it’s really important to point out right now, for people who are considering purchasing in this market, that’s it’s kind of up and down. I think if I was buying right now, and I’d love your feedback on this, I’d be really trying to focus on really good neighborhoods, where I’m getting a very quality renter that can most likely survive a downturn in the in the economy.

Jason Hartman 31:55
Yeah. And our rents held up surprisingly well during the Great Recession. It wasn’t perfect by any means. That was the worst economy in seven decades, for God’s sake. But I mean, it was surprisingly good, actually, you know, they showed a surprising amount of strength. But you always have to ask yourself, compared to what like, what else are you going to do? So the second thing I was going to mention, and listen, I’m not a precious metals bug, you know, I own some of it in some of my businesses, but, you know, gold is doing pretty well. I mean, it’s the fear trade, right? What do you think about the metals, I just want to bring that to the fore again, and then maybe some stock tips even when things really collapse? You know, if ik continues to decline like this,

George Gammon 32:41
how much time do you have?

Jason Hartman 32:42
Well, not much, but okay.

George Gammon 32:45
Because gold is I could go into the repo market repo fails the oversubscribed because that really ties into gold. If you go back to 2008. First and foremost, I want to say the way I like to do it is I compartmentalize My Portfolio into three categories. One, insurance, two investments, three speculation. So the only insurance for me is gold. And that’s only 10% at a maximum I portfolio. That just is I want

Jason Hartman 33:14
I mean, I think that’s reasonable. And is it just gold? Or do you like any of the other metals? You know, one of my companies had quite a bit of palladium. And yeah, I mean, when I say quite a bit, you know, I’m talking not that much really, in the broad scheme of things. Not compared to the real estate and stuff like that. But you know, that went through the roof. I was so surprised, you know, that.

George Gammon 33:35
I like a lot of the metals. I like the miners, but I just don’t put that put them in the same category to me. They’re not insurance. They’re a speculation. Oh, got it.

Jason Hartman 33:44
Okay. So so you do the 8010 and 10 strategy. Yeah. And so 10% is insurance, which means gold and 10% is speculative, just a bunch of, you know, speculation stuff. And the

George Gammon 33:58
way I define that is a Just betting on the price going up or down and 80% is investment, we had to find that it has to pay me to own it and become real estate. So you got you got it.

Jason Hartman 34:11
Yeah, yeah. So income property and you only like the linear markets, unless you’re doing a flip in Colombia where you live, but otherwise, it’s linear market investing, just like my strategy, right?

George Gammon 34:23

Jason Hartman 34:24
Yeah. Okay. Okay, good stuff. You can find George on YouTube. He’s got a great YouTube channel. I’ve been on it a few times. And you know, he just does a really good job educating people, obviously, I think all our listeners can viewers can see that today. So, George, thank you very much. Any final comment?

George Gammon 34:42
No, I just want to make sure that the Americans that are listening to this and I know you’ve got a worldwide audience, but specifically for the Americans, that they’re not putting their heads in the sand. Yeah. And I’m not saying that you should be worried that you should lose sleep, but I’m just saying pay attention. to what’s going on with the economy what’s going on with oil what’s going on with the repo market what’s going on with the coronavirus and and just be prepared it What’s your downside to doing that?

Jason Hartman 35:12
Yeah, not much downside be prepared. You know, I have my holistic survival show, you know, you can be prepared for very little money in terms of preparation and wash your hands and stop shaking hands, the handshake, what maybe one of the silver linings that will come out of this is the handshake needs to just go away. I mean, it feels kind of weird when you meet people when you don’t shake their hand. But, you know, maybe we should just bow like the Japanese, you know, it’s very polite, or you know, the elbow bump or something I don’t know. But the handshake is, you know, they say the mosquito has been the biggest killer of humans in history. The mosquito, the little humble mosquito, right, because it spreads disease. I’d say handshake might be number two. All right, George. Thanks for joining us

George Gammon 36:01
No problem.

Jason Hartman 36:05
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